Our Christmas Gift to You: Enneagram Mini-Series with Jackie Coban, Part 1 of 5 | Episode 34

Our Christmas Gift to You: Enneagram Mini-Series with Jackie Coban, Part 1 of 5 | Episode 34

Have you heard of the enneagram? What wisdom does the enneagram hold for you? Can you unveil and give voice to aspects of yourself that you did not know how to articulate before?

In part 1 of this 5 part mini-series, Billy and Brandy Eldridge talk to Jackie Coban about all things enneagram!

Meet Jackie Coban

Jackie Coban is an Enneagram & Life Coach: Episode 14

Jackie is a triple-certified coach in Life Coaching, Enneagram Coaching, and Neurolinguistic Programming. She is the founder of Table For 9 Coaching and the host of the Table for 9 podcast. She is a quick-witted, passionate, fire-cracker woman whose personal philosophy is that it IS possible to see people win in life, love, and work.

Jackie is a coach who works with various individuals and groups to help them embrace who they are and what they bring to the table, no pun intended. She is well-balanced in where she has worked: law offices, anti-sex trafficking movements, the non-profit sector, human resources, finance, and the like. She had one thing in common in all places: the pull to “make it work” for everyone. After leading 5+ teams simultaneously at a non-profit organization, she realized what everyone brought to the table was truly different and equally valuable, and she wanted other people to see it, too.

Visit Jackie’s website and connect on Instagram. Listen to her podcast here.

In This Podcast

Summary

  • What is the enneagram?
  • Enneagram history

What is the enneagram

It is like a personality typing system.

What I really like about it is it’s a road map to your essence, to this virtue inside of you. There’s a person at your core that your experience has not manipulated yet, the pain, the joy, the experiences of your life, there’s a person deep under there who is beautiful and flawless and pure and divine. What the enneagram does is says ‘here are the things that you are, here are the things you can be held back by, here are the lenses you need to work on to get to that divinity inside of you. (Jackie Coban)

It boils people down to 9 main personality types and branches out from there. It discusses your core fears, your desires, your childhood wounds, the way you hear things from other people. It is essentially a road map to understanding yourself.

Enneagram history

It comes from pre-colonized South America. It is deeply rooted in culture and has been passed down through oral tradition over thousands of years.

Since the enneagram has undergone a resurgence in recent years, it is sometimes warped to fit a new modern model and some people mistreat the wisdom behind the enneagram, however, at its core, the wisdom remains as potent as always.

A piece of wisdom to remember when it comes to the enneagram; the personality type that hurts your feelings the most may be the one that belongs to you.

Let Jackie know that you heard her on this podcast and get a $30 discount on your first consult.

Are you ready to find the freedom to be yourself as a beta male? Do you want permission and tools to be your best beta? Are you ready to join the revolution to find strength as a beta? If you want to be comfortable in your skin and be the most authentic beta male, then our free beta revolution course is for you. Sign up for free.

Useful links:

Meet Billy Eldridge

billy-eldridge

Meet Billy, the resident beta male. For Billy, this is a place to hang out with other beta males and the people who love them. We’re redefining what beta males look like in the world. I have learned to embrace my best beta self, and I can help you to do the same. As a therapist, I understand the need to belong. You belong here. Join the REVOLUTION.

 

Meet Brandy Eldridge

brandy-eldridge

Hello, Beta friends. I am an alpha personality who is embracing the beta way of life. I feel alive when connected with people, whether that is listening to their stories or learning about their passions. Forget small talk, let’s go deep together. Come to the table and let’s have some life-changing conversations.

 

Thanks for listening!

Did you enjoy this podcast? Feel free to leave a comment below or share this podcast on social media! You can also leave a review of the Beta Male Revolution Podcast on iTunes and subscribe!

Podcast Transcription

[BILLY]:
Beta Male Revolution is part of the Practice of the Practice Podcast Network, a family of podcasts seeking to change the world. To hear other podcasts like the Bomb Mom podcast, Imperfect Thriving, or Empowered and Unapologetic, go to practiceofthepractice.com/network.

[BRANDY]:
Hi, Beta Male Revolution, it’s Brandy Eldridge. I’m very, very, very excited. I’m always excited. But I’m very excited to have Jackie Coban back. So earlier this season, Jackie came on and spoke to us about the enneagram and Billy and I kind of talked about our enneagram number and what it’s like being our enneagram number and mistypes and all this wonderful language that a lot of our listeners didn’t know about. And so they wanted to know, what is the enneagram? Like, I don’t even know what it is to even understand this episode. So we acknowledge the fact that we possibly jumped ahead, assuming that most people knew what the enneagram was, and maybe they don’t. So we are giving a Christmas mini series this month of December, Jackie Coban, Table for 9 Coaching, is back. And Jackie is a triple certified enneagram coach, she does a lot of one on one with people dealing with personalities and goals, habits, how to communicate, what’s your leadership style with your enneagram coach? How do you communicate with your partner? How do you have better relationships just in general, using this? And Jackie gives us the space here to do it.

She’s also shedding light on a lot of our strengths, things that we personally may think are not good about us and showing us how it is good. And then some of the things that we want to work on, some of the triggers that we have, some of those habits and those mindsets that we’ve limited ourselves with. So we’ve got, I think four pieces, she’s going to go over the numbers, what the enneagram is, how we operate and kind of give this overall look at the enneagram. If you want to go deeper with Jackie, which I highly recommend, Billy and I are doing that, Jackie from Table for 9 Coaching is going to give our listeners a $30 discount. She will do a free consult with you, and then give you the discount on your first session with her. I highly recommend it. We are getting nothing from this. So please don’t feel like Jackie is our sponsor, we’re getting a kickback from this. In fact, it’s just the opposite. Like, we’re paying her to help us because Billy and I want to learn how to hear each other, how to understand each other and how to not be resentful of things that are just natural in who we are. And then appreciate those things about each other. And we’ve worked on the enneagram for a couple years now. And I will say Billy and I both attend private therapy sessions on her own. The enneagram is one of those tools that has brought us closer together, it’s ended a lot of our arguments, it’s being able to appreciate these things about one another that we always may have seen as irritating and coming to understand that they’re really gifts, and Jackie takes us on that journey of understanding your gifts.

So we’re going to do a miniseries with her. Merry Christmas. And again, if you have more questions for Jackie, we’ll also be doing a Q&A. Some people have already sent in their questions, you’re more than welcome to do that as well. And we can try to address those later on. And we hope to have her on again to go even deeper with the enneagram. I believe for betas and alphas, it’s a really great way of identifying who we are. It’s another way of just digging deeper into what’s inside of us and unlocking things in us and being free and living a life of more freedom. So here it is, Beta Male Revolution. Merry Christmas.

[BRANDY]:
Hey, Beta Male Revolution. Hello Billy.

[BILLY]:
Hello.

[BRANDY]:
Welcome back, Jackie.

[JACKIE]:
Hi.

[BRANDY]:
We are so happy to have Jackie Coban back on because we had her, I don’t remember how many episodes ago, but we got some questions on what is the enneagram? I didn’t know what it was. Who is this fantastic lady you have on the podcast with the sultry voice, talking and speaking of enneagram when I don’t understand enneagram? And then you have Billy and Brandy who are, speaking in third person, who are very much identifying with it, emotional, talking about it, and we didn’t really give our listeners that background. And so what we want to do is have Jackie on again and again and again, to do a mini series going through each one of the numbers. But for today we’re just going to kind of talk to Jackie about what is the enneagram, what it’s not, what it’s used for, and dive more into what she does all day long for people and what she does so well. So, Jackie, thank you for being here again. We love having you. I feel like we’ve known you 100 years. So what is the enneagram, Jackie?

[JACKIE]:
Oh, I cannot wait to unpack this. Thank you guys for thinking of me, for having me, it’s so good to hear your voices again. Now I don’t have to listen to the podcast episode you guys were on on my podcast over and over to hear you guys. I can hear it in real time. So, just to jump right in, the enneagram is like a personality typing system. And I’m gonna say like, because I think a lot of people have issues with typing their personality, because personality can change. And that is 100% true. The reason I like this and found it really the most sustainable, to be honest, and the most compelling is, it’s not really about your personality, because, you know, all three of us could walk into a room, do the same exact thing. And well, we could say that’s a personality, but we’re very different people.

What I really like about it is that it’s a roadmap to your essence, to this like virtue inside of you, this person that you know, there’s a person at your core that your experience has not manipulated, yet the pain, the joy, the things that you’ve experienced in your life, there’s a person deep under there who is beautiful and flawless and pure and divine. And what the enneagram does is it says, well, here are the things that you are, and here are the things that you can be held back by, here are the lenses that you look through that you’re going to need to work on to get to that divinity inside of you. And so to keep it really short, it’s a personality typing system. And if you want to stick to that, that’s totally fine. It’s old, like it, you know, the Myers Briggs, Carl Jung thing, I mean, it predates that by about 1500 to 2000 years. So it’s pretty rooted in ancient history. But it boils people down to nine main personality types by that virtue. And pretty much branches out from there, talks about your core fears, your motivations, your desires, the lenses you look through, like I said, childhood wounds, the way that you hear things, which is super important, because I can tell you one thing, and you can hear a completely different thing. So it’s a roadmap, in short, I think that’s the best way to describe it.

[BRANDY]:
Okay, so when you say roadmap, which I love this, and you touched on 1000 different things, and I have 1000 different questions. But I want to save that for when we go through the numbers. Can you just tell us how you have used it in your own personal life and how you’ve used it with your relationships?

[JACKIE]:
Oh, yeah, I would love to. Because I think experience is so telling. And to be honest, the enneagram is born out of storytelling and an oral tradition so I love this. Essentially, for me, I had been in a really, well, I mean, I’ll start right at the beginning as a young girl in my early teens. And even in childhood, I just really felt like I had to work really hard to be loved. And I couldn’t recognize receiving love the way I was giving it to others so blatantly. And it was always confusing. And it made for a pattern and a string of toxic relationships with toxic, toxic ass boys. And, you know, and then growing up, it even leaked into work because you know, who you are, is who you are, wherever you are. And so it leaked into work. I was a people pleaser, I was a yes man. I didn’t know how to say no. And I started to realize, I can’t reject a guy. I can’t say no to a role at work, even though I’m already doing six of them. I can’t ask for a pay raise even though I’m getting $300 a week. I can’t do any of these things because I don’t know who I am and there’s no way to negate that. There’s no way to negate these things coming in. I can’t think of a single reason to say no.

And so I had a friend reach out to me, after I kind of went ballistic, quit my job, which I was doing like seven roles at and just I had burnt the eff out. And she was like, hey, there’s this thing called the enneagram. Like, have you heard of it? You should look into it. And I took a couple tests online and I was like, none of these are me. This is stupid. And so she sent me a book and I read through the book. And when I got to my personality type, to my enneagram type, it described this person who at core, at virtue was an extremely beautiful, humble, meek person who wanted to show people that they were loved and needed, and the roadblocks on the way there were self abnegation, was that thought saying well, if this person needs to feel loved, then there’s no time for me to feel loved. And no one knows what I need. So I might as well just meet everybody else’s needs. And I can’t communicate what my needs are because that makes me unapproachable, unlovable and unsafe. And so it started to unpack these things and I look back on the trajectory of my life and how I communicated, and how I wasn’t able to communicate based on the fact that I have always, I was always meant to be that virtue, that person right at my core. And then life gets in the way, as it always does. And we think life gets in the way at like, 21, after college, but life gets in the way when you’re like four and just keeps getting in the way after that.

So after years of healing, and doing work through the enneagram, and letting the enneagram like, stick its finger in my face a little bit, I finally got to look at my naked self in the mirror and I was like, oh my god, she’s beautiful and fugly at the same time. And she needs some work. And so that’s been the journey for me. And when I became a coach, when I said, I want to dedicate my life to helping people who want to work with me, I was like, there’s no way I can’t use this, like this is, you know, like to use the language I used before, is a roadmap. It says, we start here, and we end here, we start at humility, and we end at humility for my personality type, but there’s a lot of crap in the way and it’s supposed to be there. And we’re supposed to manage it. And it’s this. It’s like a playbook. You know, it’s the most beautiful thing.

[BILLY]:
Oh, hey, Jackie. It’s Billy.

[JACKIE]:
Hi, Billy.

[BILLY]:
I love that it’s like, well over five minutes in and I haven’t even said a word. Because I get to sit back and bask in the awesomeness of these two women talking about such an important topic. And the enneagram has helped me do some of that work in my personal life where that’s not a threat to me, this is, I just get to marinate in some truth with you guys. And so in talking about how it’s helped your life, I get so many people when you talk about it being a kind of a mystery and ancient. And that’s what I love about it, because I do clinical work and people want clinical stuff. They want the Myers Brigg, they want data driven. And to me, that’s stuffy. This opens people up in a way to the spirituality and the philosophy of life in the process. So when you talk about it being old, what’s your understanding of where in the world does this thing come from?

[JACKIE]:
Yeah, so I know that it does come from South America. But like, before South America was like really cool resorts. I’m talking about like, Aztec society, Inca society, I think it really was rooted in with the Incas. But it actually started with those virtues. It was never because, you know, when we type people with the enneagram, we go based on their core fear, because I think honestly, it’s the 2000s in America, and that’s the quickest thing that people recognize, is the core fear hiding inside of them. But really, it was that virtue that sat inside everybody that the Incans used to type people in this personality. And that’s really because it strikes that same nerve that the core fear strikes in that, oh, if I could just be that person. And that’s when you realize I am that person. I’m just having a hard time getting there.

And it being so ancient rooted. I mean, like I have, I’m part of a culture, that’s one of the oldest surviving cultures in the world. I am Iranian, Assyrian. And so it’s one of those things that for me, I think clicked right away, was this is deeply rooted in culture. And, you know, I think a lot of people, I’ll just joke around and say this, I think a lot of people look at the enneagram and I’ve heard this feedback myself is, like everything else, the white man took it and messed it up. And, you know, I mean, we can fight about that all day but everything gets manipulated as it moves to different cultures and countries. But the enneagram has this beautiful way of staying consistent because it’s about the deep rooted things and not about personality. Because, you know, I’ve looked at, I love Myers Briggs, I’ve done Myers Briggs, but you go into other things, like, you know, what color are you? What’s your aura? What’s…? You know, and those things are really fun. And, you know, can be educational, I guess, if there’s something to back it up. But the reality of it is those things can be fleeting in a moment, and I think the ancientness, I don’t know if that’s a word, but just the fact that it’s been passed down from oral tradition to oral tradition, generation to generation, culture to culture, and has still held its shape says a lot about how it does the inner work with people.

[BILLY]:
Yeah. We’ll kind of go into some of that, where we’ve kind of taken it and we’ve pulled it into a lab and began to dissect it in our more American culture and it’s become trendy and there’s buzzwords around the enneagram and [unclear]…

[BRANDY]:
Hasn’t it been like, isn’t it..? There’s like a resurgence of it within the Christian church, right? That’s been in the last, what, seven, eight years, it’s kind of gotten really big.

[BILLY]:
Well, and I think everybody wants to stake their claim on it and say, you know, it’s ours, or it’s this, or it’s that and the clinicians want to, like I said, take it in a lab and dissect it. But I’ve always liked what Rob Bell said about a rainbow. You can tell me scientifically why it exists but you can’t tell me why I think it’s beautiful. And I think there’s a beauty and a mystery to the enneagram. But what about all the buzz around it? Do you think that’s taking away any of its power? Or do you think it’s a good thing that more people are finding out about it and however you get there, if you really take the deep dive, it’ll get you there.

[JACKIE]:
I think it’s a little bit of everything. And that’s, you know, not trying to be unproblematic by just not saying my opinion. It’s really I think it’s a little bit of everything. Because, for example, let’s say I’m a faith person, and I can say, you know what, however you get there, you get there, but there’s something in the back of my head that also says but like, please don’t be fed any lies or, or misconstruing like, pillars of this thing along the way. So I think there’s a little bit of in between, I see the memes on Instagram, I see, you know, the, you know, the funny things and I read the books and, and I’m like, you know what, whatever gets you there gets you there. And there’s a part of me that goes, how come every single mother effin meme about enneagram fours is them crying? Like, what? You know, so there’s that in between. I try to negate that and balance, I like to be as clear as possible. When I’m making my content, I try to ask my clients, I ask my friends who’ve typed as certain types. And, you know, I try to dig as deep because I want it to be very, but then also, and this hasn’t gone up on the internet yet but like, I also created, like, funny quotes from the office that represent each enneagram type, you know. I want that beautiful in between. But I think that once culture takes over something, we want to make it fit us instead of saying, okay, this is how it’s supposed to be. And so I either make peace with the parts I don’t get, or I wait for another day or something like that, you know, where, you know, like I said, you know, in America, you type based on your core fears. And that was just never the case. But it’s what stuck. And it’s not incorrect. It’s just who we are as a culture and how it helped us to like, you know, get around it.

And you’re right, you do try to stake claim, there’s, I’ve actually had a lot of people say like, I want to work with you as a life coach, not an enneagram coach, because like, I can’t, I’m not a Christian. And I’m like, oh, let me take you back. This is not a Christian thing. It’s an incredible tool used at churches, and other nonprofits and other businesses, simply because it’s a tell all and it helps you work with people that you otherwise can’t just ignore in your office, you know, so just trying to paint that picture. But I mean, you can really, it can go, when it hits a culture or hits a group of people, it can go one of two ways, you either it’s manipulated so much, it’s lost its shape, or, you know, you’re you’re just having people within a culture find their footing in that thing. And I think that’s really what it’s been within, even within the church and with America, like, I think people are trying to find their footing. There are some people who have completely lost it all together, and they’re like, I’m gonna give you the middle finger, because I’m an eight and that’s it. And like, that’s just obviously not the case. If you know anything about the enneagram, or you use it well, you know that that’s not a thing that you do, so.

[BRANDY]:
Or actually, it is a thing you do, and then you could go, oh, man that was [unclear]. That’s an immature move for my eightness.

[BILLY]:
And just like being in recovery, I use this for the enneagram. They talk about uncovering, discovering, and discarding things that are holding you back, but hanging on to those drinks you have and learning from them. And that’s what the enneagram has done for me, and I don’t talk about it a lot in counseling and therapy because I don’t believe I’ve sat with it long enough. And I believe there is, so for you, before you became an enneagram expert and someone who works with people, how long did it have to be a part of your life, did you sit with it and it become a life changing force for you before you then moved into giving it away?

[BRANDY]:
Oh, I love that.

[JACKIE]:
Um, okay, so there’s two sides to this. For me, the first side obviously is I’m never going to mislead a single person that I work with, I refuse to, you know, I don’t like the whole, fake it till you make it. So I’m not the kind of person that promises a client, I can do this thing and then Google’s how to do it when we get off the phone. Either I can, or I can’t, because I want to give you the best experience. So it was really also about learning all of the information that I needed to learn. And I’m still learning, I’m always learning. But on the other side of it was making sure first and foremost that I was, you know, health is a sliding scale, and it can go back and forth within an hour. But just making sure that for the most part, I sat in a healthy place, in a high level of function, and that even in the parts of my life I didn’t, there was active work, active accountability and that, you know, even for my type, being a person who loves to help people, that there’s no hidden motive behind wanting to point out the best parts of people. I didn’t want any recognition in it at all. I want to make sure that people have a sustainable way to reach their goals. And it’s funny because I tell people all the time, they’re like, I have all these goals, and I tell them right at the get, I’m like, we might work on your goals, like in the last session, but the first eight sessions are going to be you figuring out what has been stopping you. And I’m telling you, if you do those full well, your goals will sort themselves out, I promise you, promise. So it’s kind of like that.

[BRANDY]:
Alright, so for our first time enneagram people, we’re about to get into the nine types. And so Jackie has kind of given us an outline of, or she’s talked to us about the roadmap of the enneagram, getting to those beautiful virtues, your fears, all that stuff, to get us from point A to point B in our lives and growth. So Jackie, is there anything we need to know before we get into the good stuff because I’m, I’m like, super excited about getting into our numbers now. Because I need them, I need to understand people to be able to work with people, and my family, and my relationships at work, and my relationships with my community. And I need to learn all of them, not just about me. But how other people, when they react the way they do, how can I counter react in a way that’s productive, and in my relationship with my husband, and all those wonderful things of really getting in and understanding the other eight types besides mine. So any last words before we get into the sexy stuff?

[BILLY]:
The deep dive.

[JACKIE]:
The deep dive. Yes, actually, I have a couple of thoughts that I think would be really helpful to share. You know, the first is that you can only be one type. If you’re struggling between two types, that is very, very normal, because I struggle between three of them. So you can only be one type. Sometimes you hear the core fear of the type, and you don’t immediately connect with it and that is a survival instinct. So you can be like I am 100% this type, but this core fear doesn’t sit with me, that’s pretty normal too. You are the only deciding factor when it comes to determining your type. And if you hear all these personality traits, and you’re like, that’s me, that’s me, that’s me, take a minute, take a beat, take a lap and try again. Because it’s not based on your personality, there are just some personality traits or characteristics that come out of you living out of a core fear or a motivation for a while. And the last thing that I would say is the thing that really struck me the most, is the description that hurts your feelings the most is usually the one that’s yours, so don’t hate me. But, um, yeah.

[BILLY]:
You know, and for me, like my number, it just, like, attacked me and wouldn’t let me go. And as much as I didn’t want it, I couldn’t get away from it. It hit me square in the chest and there was no question. It was like, wow, oh, my gosh, this is who I am. And but then I’ve seen people like Brandy, you know, kind of go back and forth, and where do I fit, and where is it? So, I think there’s both.

[BILLY]:
Yeah. I went a whole year thinking my number was a different number.

[JACKIE]:
Really? What did you think you were?

[BRANDY]:
Well, everyone told me I was an eight or a three. So I thought I was an eight or a three. And when I would take the online test, or when I’d read the stuff, I would go, yeah, that makes sense. I do a lot of that. I do a lot of that. And it wasn’t until I got into the core stuff, when it was used more of a, instead of a personality test and just like I identify with these personality traits, that I was talking to my therapist who knows nothing about the enneagram and I was talking to her about just how I felt this pull that I’m supposed to be a certain way, but that’s not who I am at my core and I’m just really struggling because I’m expected to be this but in my heart, this is what I want. This is who I am. When I’m talking to her about it, I went, oh my gosh, that’s the struggle I’m having is not knowing who I really am, but who I have to be right now. And it just opened a floodgate to do some work on some stuff I really needed to do some work on and still need to do work on.

[JACKIE]:
Oh, yeah, we are going to be learning until, I mean, one of my favorite quotes is from Michelangelo, not the turtle, the guy who painted the Sistine Chapel. But he says, the quote is, I’m still learning. And he said it when he was 89. And that is one of my favorite quotes, because I thought it was just me that I’m like, God darn it, I got to another five years of life and I gotta learn something over, I have to learn something about myself I didn’t like. And it is a beautiful journey of uncovering yourself. It’s like, it’s like digging for gold, but you find gold at every single level, you stop long enough to like, love the gold, examine the gold, make it part of who you are, and then you realize there’s more underneath, so you keep digging. And it’s just, it’s beautiful. It’s a beautiful process, but it’s brutal. It’s brutiful, right? It’s one of those combo platters, you know?

[BILLY]:
All I can say to our listeners in Beta Male Revolution, hang on, this is gonna be a badass time, go after this like you’re grabbing onto the hem of a garment, because it’s something you can practically use in your life that, given the right amount of time and digging into it, it can provide freedom. And it’s a tool that’s been around so long. How did we miss it? Here it is today.

[BRANDY]:
Go digging.

[BILLY]:
Let’s go digging.

[BILLY]:
Are you ready to find freedom to be yourself as a beta male? Do you want permission and tools to be your best beta? Are you ready to join the revolution to find your strength as a beta? If you want to be comfortable in your own skin and be the most authentic beta male, then our free Beta Male Revolution course is for you. Sign up for free at betamalerevolution.com/course.

This podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regard to the subject matter covered. This is given with the understanding that neither the host, Practice of the Practice, or the guest are providing legal, mental health, or other professional information. If you need a professional, you should find one.

Beta Male Revolution is part of the Practice of the Practice Podcast Network, a network of podcasts seeking to help you thrive, imperfectly. To hear other podcasts like the Bomb Mom Podcast, Imperfect Thriving, or Empowered and Unapologetic, go to practiceofthepractice.com/network.

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